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【山梨県】「持続可能性なき建設」サッカーなど総合球技場 建設に改めて否定的な考え「甲府の使用料減免措置の見直し避けられず」

スポンサーリンク
150名無しさん@恐縮ですID:1CmT7SeH02023/06/27(火) 15:08:34.35
世界の三笘とか世界の久保がいるだろw
152名無しさん@恐縮ですID:nmoTZHdE02023/06/27(火) 15:10:09.96
先日、北斗市の食堂に入ったら
店に2007年の甲府商業甲子園出場のペナントが貼ってあったわ

甲府商業は堀内恒夫の学校だし
J2にカネ出すより甲府商業を強化する方が圧倒的に需要あるだろ

172名無しさん@恐縮ですID:aO5eBQwS0
>>152
甲府商業野球部の現役部員は選手34人だけど
https://www.kchs.city.kofu.yamanashi.jp/seitokai/bukatsudo/baseball/
男子サッカー部は85人いるらしい
https://www.kchs.city.kofu.yamanashi.jp/seitokai/bukatsudo/soccer_m/
https://www.kchs.city.kofu.yamanashi.jp/seitokai/bukatsudo/baseball/
https://www.kchs.city.kofu.yamanashi.jp/seitokai/bukatsudo/soccer_m/
156名無しさん@恐縮ですID:lrPsTUZm02023/06/27(火) 15:12:27.66
座席数15000以上 (✕なし)

トイレ数 (✕なし)

全面天然芝 (✕東京ドーム、神宮、ZOZO、バンテリン、京セラ、PayPay)

座席の1/3以上の屋根 (✕楽天モバイル、ハマスタ、神宮、甲子園、ほっと神戸、MAZDA)

多分J1基準満たしてるのエスコンフィールドだけだと思う

158名無しさん@恐縮ですID:9rKMqU3502023/06/27(火) 15:14:53.01
Jの新スタジアム建設見てて思うのが建てた事に満足しちゃってそこから成績低迷するチームのまあ多いこと

何なのあれ?
そもそもホームで勝つということの価値をJはもっと高めないと駄目だわ
負け過ぎですハッキリ言って
これは選手もだしフロントとしてもだよね

テレビ放映のある試合の強度の低い堕落スコアレスドローとかエンタメ舐めんなって話

空気を読む能力が低いんだよ組織として
これはサッカーそのものにも必要なスキルなのにね

160ID:wZPmV8dt02023/06/27(火) 15:15:55.93
🐷「シブヤガー」
161名無しさん@恐縮ですID:uqHO/EAe02023/06/27(火) 15:17:06.25
だいたい山梨にプロサッカーチームがあることを国民の大多数は知らないと思うよ。
162名無しさん@恐縮ですID:/hLPN05202023/06/27(火) 15:17:15.77
サガン鳥栖破綻したら人口7万人でスタジアム維持してる鳥栖市はどうなるんやろか?

鳥栖市は金持ってそうだから大丈夫か

167名無しさん@恐縮ですID:kKzpoqjN0
>>162
筆頭株主はなぜか久留米の会社なんだよな

https://sakanowa.jp/topics/71551
また株主の構成は、ベストアメニティ株式会社が11万2492株で47.92パーセント、朝日 I&R ホールディングス株式会社が3万3400株で14.23パーセント、株式会社サガテレビが1億6760株で7.14パーセント、株式会社イノセントが1万6700株で7.11パーセント、澁谷食品株式会社が1万6700株で7.11パーセントとなっている。

164名無しさん@恐縮ですID:zlDUgDkK02023/06/27(火) 15:20:12.54
税リーグまじで相手にされなくなってきたやん

芸スポもサカ豚記者が消えて八百坂先生でアンチサッカー板になったし

171名無しさん@恐縮ですID:ObnG1e3s0
>>164
視豚が視スレで八百坂訴えた方がいいんじゃないか?とかブツブツ言っててクッソ笑った
なーんも自分ではできないくせにな
168名無しさん@恐縮ですID:aN7JeasA02023/06/27(火) 15:22:53.95
Jリーグ止めますか
それとも自治体止めますか
169名無しさん@恐縮ですID:oNElqkN202023/06/27(火) 15:23:20.95
正直山学の施設の方が圧倒的なんだもんな
170名無しさん@恐縮ですID:VfOruKA502023/06/27(火) 15:23:54.83
一番の疑問は箱物に金をかけることだな
Jリーグはなにが目的なんだよ
173名無しさん@恐縮ですID:ClWMmVsj02023/06/27(火) 15:24:54.08
山梨人口80万人ないからな
やるとしても今のスタジアムのシートとか改装したりこどもや家族連れが行きやすいようにしたほうがいいよ どうせJ1に行きたいと言うけどむしろJ1に行くほうがヤバいって
174名無しさん@恐縮ですID:O6rmNuK802023/06/27(火) 15:25:20.43
平塚市長にもこれくらいハッキリとモノを言ってほしい

BY 平塚市民

177名無しさん@恐縮ですID:uzWXlil+02023/06/27(火) 15:27:13.94
いいぞ~いいぞ~
おれは開かないけどこういうのでアフィサイトなり動画なりで拡散することで税リーグが淘汰されてくのを望む
おかしいということがわからないといけない

もっと五輪競技に税金使ってやれ

178名無しさん@恐縮ですID:BOCeG7Lh02023/06/27(火) 15:27:17.76
八百坂先生、野球にとって最大の脅威となってるサッカーを滅ぼしてください
200名無しさん@恐縮ですID:ClWMmVsj0
>>178
笑いの種にはなっとるけど
179名無しさん@恐縮ですID:AjQOGiUZ02023/06/27(火) 15:27:36.67
君たちは税リーグだ
180名無しさん@恐縮ですID:uzWXlil+02023/06/27(火) 15:28:24.84
税リーグが認知されてきたな
自治体にも
181名無しさん@恐縮ですID:20aN2tp502023/06/27(火) 15:29:28.70
ウチの地元はラグビーからかっぱらったな。
198名無しさん@恐縮ですID:etieHwt60
>>181
近鉄が金を出して建設したラグビー場を、FC大阪がぶんどってしまった
ひどい話だよ
208名無しさん@恐縮ですID:ClWMmVsj0
>>198
金は払ってるの?近鉄が問題なければいいと思うけど?
212名無しさん@恐縮ですID:pDi/32jE0
>>208
近鉄が市に寄付したのよ
実態は維持費払えないから市に押しつけたんだろうけど
221名無しさん@恐縮ですID:etieHwt60
>>208
近鉄が東大阪市にスタジアムを寄付したから、今は東大阪市の持ち物
FC大阪は東大阪市から指定管理を受けているが、FC大阪がサッカーの興行でスタジアムの維持管理の費用を払えるわけない
だからFC大阪は、市から受け取る指定管理料とラグビーなどの試合のスタジアム使用料でスタジアムを運営してる
228名無しさん@恐縮ですID:bmZ4SYG30
>>221
花園ラグビー場の第二グラウンドをサッカー場に変えて東大阪市に寄付する条件で指定管理者になったけど工事が頓挫して進まないから管理者権限で第一グラウンドを使ってる状態なんだよな
287名無しさん@恐縮ですID:ClWMmVsj0
>>221
後半は分かるけどやはり市から金もらうのがサッカーのデフォだよね
その金額に見う仕事をしてるかだね
川崎もフロンターレが昔の川崎球場を管理してるよ アメフトだけど人は富士通以外は来ないねえ ロッテで一番客来ない日よりも来ない ココで勝てば優勝ですら半分ぐらいかな? 1019記念でロッテや近鉄の選手呼んだほうが人入ってるかも w
207名無しさん@恐縮ですID:etieHwt60
>>198
しかもFC大阪はJ3なのに天皇杯大阪府予選で2年連続で関大に敗北
サッカーの実力もアマチュア並なのに、スタジアムだけが立派
182名無しさん@恐縮ですID:AGaiG0e602023/06/27(火) 15:32:23.98
専スタが増えて欲しいならJリーグとJFAがBリーグみたいにしっかりしたビジネスモデルを用意しないと無理だよ
そこには当然人工芝の容認も含まれる
185名無しさん@恐縮ですID:81ok8XzU02023/06/27(火) 15:33:42.89
スター選手が出てきても国内リーグの金と魅力が皆無でみんな海外だからな
それ自体は仕方ないけど、金稼げないなら稼げないなりにやれや
186名無しさん@恐縮ですID:mPs/biyt02023/06/27(火) 15:34:01.74
税リーグはこのままだと自滅だ。そうなりたくなかったら、野球に八つ当たりする前に改革するんだな。バブル時代の発想でここまで膨張してしまった。チーム数多すぎるし、スタジアムも身の丈に合ったレベルにしたほうがいい。
193名無しさん@恐縮ですID:Q0LcKrYd0
>>186
これな 根本的な原因は無視して野球があ~だからな
サッカーファンって頭弱いのかな?
それと放映権料金の問題も、女子サッカーのワールドカップ
あれもFIFAがアホ見たいなボッタクリ請求している
もうサッカーは金の亡者の大会になっている
204名無しさん@恐縮ですID:ClWMmVsj0
>>193
お金も土地もないのにスタジアム作れ
金貸せ 金返せません 資本金溶かします だもんな これがバブル脳なのか?
187名無しさん@恐縮ですID:o+W5B63202023/06/27(火) 15:35:14.98
?????wwwwwwwww

「一刻も早く2万5千人収容のスタジアムを」ファジアーノ岡山・木村正明オーナー “J1昇格” 見据え訴え

「一刻も早く2万5千人収容のスタジアムを」ファジアーノ岡山・木村正明オーナー “J1昇格” 見据え訴え | TBS NEWS DIG (1ページ)
悲願のJ1昇格を目指すファジアーノ岡山。そのファジアーノ岡山のまさに「生みの親」である、前・Jリーグ専務理事で現ファジアーノ岡山のオーナー・木村正明さんに、「J1昇格」「新スタジアム構想」などについて、… (1ページ)

―以上の理由から「新しいスタジアムを」ということなんですが、ただお金の問題や場所をどうするんだ、という問題があると思うんですけど、そのあたりはどのようにお考えですか?

(木村正明オーナー)
「まずは『新しいスタジアムが必要なんだ』ということ自体を皆様にお伝えしていきたい、というのが最初だと思っています」

188名無しさん@恐縮ですID:bzxb3HSq02023/06/27(火) 15:35:36.67
甲府ってリニア止まれば
すごい栄えそうじゃね?
今でもさ、豊田とか日野とかから
中央線で頑張ってる人いるじゃん

俺の知ってる限りだと上野原ってところから秋葉原に通ってる同僚いたよ
甲府から新宿まで何分か分からないけど
そういうインフラ整えてから、
サッカー100年計画だっけ
それを推し進めればいい

野球場は意外と多い
休みの日とか
シーズンになるとふらっと寄れる
サッカーはなんかデカすぎて
ふらっとよってもビール売ってるわけでもないし

189名無しさん@恐縮ですID:9p6mEv9z02023/06/27(火) 15:36:39.68
これから税収がどんどん減るのに
サッカーに毎年つぎ込み続けるとかありえないからな
山梨はまともだ
190名無しさん@恐縮ですID:muvfLvNi02023/06/27(火) 15:36:51.93
最早プロリーグとして機能してないじゃん
住民がそれで満足してるならべつにいいけど
こんだけ税金におんぶにだっこじゃ「プロ」名乗ってて恥ずかしくないのかね
クラブ運営者も選手も
192名無しさん@恐縮ですID:7BvR+o+r02023/06/27(火) 15:39:42.87
人工芝でもあかんのか?
194名無しさん@恐縮ですID:ObnG1e3s02023/06/27(火) 15:40:52.17
ぶっちゃけ川淵が30年前に提唱したスキームが完全に破たんしたのよ
当時は甘い考えの自治体が多くて税リーグ誘致したいとこそこそこあって
殿様商売で税金で面倒見てくれるならという条件を飲ませてた
今もそのノリで平塚市に狂った提案した湘南がフルボッコにされたし何もかも時代は変わったのさ
ゼイリーグは地方のお荷物になってるのが実態よ
255名無しさん@恐縮ですID:RwFQeRk50
>>194
そこらじゅうにあるから
希少価値もないし

仙台なんて積極的に始めたが
プロ野球が来たり
バスケットボールが人気出てきたりで
いらない子になりつつある

304名無しさん@恐縮ですID:6xQVdi0A0
>>255
ベガルタはJ2でダントツの集客数でJ1並に入ってるぞ。
楽天が弱すぎてかなりベガルタに流れてる。
バスケは敵にならない数。
214名無しさん@恐縮ですID:nmoTZHdE0
>>194
30年前の開始直後がバブルでピークだったからだろ
それを見た自治体が騙されて夢を見てしまった
当時はマジでNPBが税リーグに置き換わるとか言われてた
226名無しさん@恐縮ですID:aO5eBQwS0
>>214
J1全体の平均観客動員の最多は2019年の20,751人
発足初年度の1993年は17,976人だった
233名無しさん@恐縮ですID:nmoTZHdE0
>>226
当時はデカイ専用スタジアムがなかったらじゃないの?
集客率が100%近くて限界だった
税リーグのチケットとかプラチナチケットで取るのが大変だったんだよ

多分その時のイメージが残ってて無駄に観客席の多いスタジアムを強要してるんじゃないの?

239名無しさん@恐縮ですID:aO5eBQwS0
>>233
>当時はデカイ専用スタジアムがなかったらじゃないの?

デカイ専用スタジアムの集客効果てきめんですね

246名無しさん@恐縮ですID:etieHwt60
>>239
客が増えてその分クラブが儲かってるかというと、そんなことないから
スタジアムのコストもいるし
269名無しさん@恐縮ですID:H3SHn0lf0
>>226
発足時は報道とか物凄かったが平均二万も行ってないんかい
サカ豚はことあるごとに野球はメディアガー言ってるがあんまり関係なさそうだな
373名無しさん@恐縮ですID:pn+FP6lS0
>>269
タダ券と年間パスだよ。
Jリーグの一試合単価異常に安いからね。プラチナチケットだった初期の頃の方が売上上だろうね。
昔はダフやが券買うよ券買うよって列作っていたけど、今じゃメルカリでも売れてないからね。
238名無しさん@恐縮ですID:aN7JeasA0
>>226
その頃は駒場は今より収容今より少ないし、名古屋は瑞穂陸上改装中で一回り小さいラグビー場使用してたから比較にならない
265名無しさん@恐縮ですID:cWXRiWNe0
>>226
で、客単価と試合あたりの売上は?
創立時はプラチナチケットだったけど今はコアサポが1試合1,000円以上使わないよね。
219名無しさん@恐縮ですID:ibQ9ZDB/0
>>214
実際W杯終わって以降スタジアム建設ってほとんどすすまねーよな

広島より北広島のが先に完成する始末

234名無しさん@恐縮ですID:dtI5ZSXJ0
>>219
広島は金も無いのに場所には拘るって最悪ムーブかましてたから…
むしろ良くまとまったよ
旧市民球場跡地問題勃発してから20年かかったんだからな
674名無しさん@恐縮ですID:nXVfqOSi0
>>234
土地さえ用意してくれれば 折り鶴保管庫つきスタジアムを自力で建てるとかクラブ側が息巻いてたけど
折り鶴保管庫って 今建ってるのにもあるのかね?w
675名無しさん@恐縮ですID:NNKsmqLQ0
>>674
で、W豚C見てたアメリカ人は人口の何パーセントだったか
算数できたかな?
早く何パーセントのアメリカ人がW豚C見てたのか教えてくれよ
684名無しさん@恐縮ですID:nXVfqOSi0
>>675
手あたり次第 ネトウヨ認定してるテヲンみたい奴だな オマエ
オマエみたいなんがおるから Jリーグへのヘイトが溜まっていくんだか わからんようだの

ちなみにオレはWCはたのしませてもらったよ アベマだったかなにかで Jリーグは見ないがなw
次はIDが変わった0時過ぎにお出ましかな まあ頑張れw

676名無しさん@恐縮ですID:nXVfqOSi0
>>675
何言ってんだ?このバカ  IDくらい確かめられんのか?
オマエにアンカーなんぞ打った覚えはないわ
それとも IDコロコロとか妄想抜かすんか?w
679名無しさん@恐縮ですID:uBMICsF+0
>>675
ここは日本だから日本で人気があるか無いかの話じゃないかなあ
このままじゃサッカーヤバいってのから目を逸らして「野球ガー」って言ってても何も変わらないし
野球は「このままじゃヤバい」って思ったから観客増になる様に動いたんだし
247名無しさん@恐縮ですID:bibYgDps0
>>194
ほんとこれな
195名無しさん@恐縮ですID:tCPt1f6I02023/06/27(火) 15:41:45.92
建設費も維持費もかかりすぎだな
もっと安上がりで済む方法考えないと
197名無しさん@恐縮ですID:NAEbaYCx02023/06/27(火) 15:43:37.93
Jリーグって自治体にタカるだけなの?放映権料だのスポンサー料だのから分配とかしないの?
199名無しさん@恐縮ですID:9XkTHvrp02023/06/27(火) 15:45:22.09
>補填のためヴァンフォーレ甲府のスタジアム使用料など、年間約8500万円の減免措置の見直しが避けられず、チームの経営に重大な影響を与えるとしました。

普通に読むとスタジアムを建てたい競技関係者とやらは8500万払わされると経営に影響があるからその金を払わないのか
いい根性してんなw
寄生虫なんて生易しいもんじゃねえな

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